Comments on: Pay the Designer! http://www.8164.org/pay-the-designer/ Jin Yang's blog on web design, philosophy of Taoism and life in general. Tue, 09 Mar 2010 23:08:54 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Brett Mouron http://www.8164.org/pay-the-designer/comment-page-2/#comment-12990 Brett Mouron Fri, 18 Dec 2009 19:05:24 +0000 http://www.8164.org/?p=1062#comment-12990 http://genevadesigns.net/2009/12/brick-laying-a-metaphor-of-speculative-work/ http://genevadesigns.net/2009/12/brick-laying-a-metaphor-of-speculative-work/

]]> By: Brett Mouron http://www.8164.org/pay-the-designer/comment-page-2/#comment-12989 Brett Mouron Fri, 18 Dec 2009 19:04:58 +0000 http://www.8164.org/?p=1062#comment-12989 Thanks for the post Jin! I used your article's inspiration to write up my own experience with speculative work. And I had to post the video for it is a true GEM! Thanks for the post Jin! I used your article’s inspiration to write up my own experience with speculative work. And I had to post the video for it is a true GEM!

]]> By: Jonathan Hollin http://www.8164.org/pay-the-designer/comment-page-2/#comment-9959 Jonathan Hollin Mon, 31 Aug 2009 11:53:18 +0000 http://www.8164.org/?p=1062#comment-9959 I have a blanket no-free work policy with any client. When I quote for any project I take into account every cost that I anticipate incurring and I estimate how many hours I think a project will take to complete. Then I add a third, because Murphy's Law can kick in at any point. The rest is easy. I have a non-variable hourly rate, which is non-negotiable. Why should I work for less? To do so devalues me. So I simply don't do it. I simply decline any project that compromises this value. Even in a recession I've found that clients seem to respect you more when you won't negotiate on price. The sub-conscious message to them is, "as I value my time so much, you can be sure that I'm going to take your time seriously too." It's reassuring to them. Anyway, yours is a great article Michael. Very well written and right on the nail. Nice one. I have a blanket no-free work policy with any client. When I quote for any project I take into account every cost that I anticipate incurring and I estimate how many hours I think a project will take to complete. Then I add a third, because Murphy’s Law can kick in at any point.

The rest is easy. I have a non-variable hourly rate, which is non-negotiable. Why should I work for less? To do so devalues me. So I simply don’t do it. I simply decline any project that compromises this value.

Even in a recession I’ve found that clients seem to respect you more when you won’t negotiate on price. The sub-conscious message to them is, “as I value my time so much, you can be sure that I’m going to take your time seriously too.” It’s reassuring to them.

Anyway, yours is a great article Michael. Very well written and right on the nail. Nice one.

]]> By: AIGA President Debbie Millman on spec work | David Airey, graphic designer http://www.8164.org/pay-the-designer/comment-page-1/#comment-8523 AIGA President Debbie Millman on spec work | David Airey, graphic designer Tue, 11 Aug 2009 12:38:13 +0000 http://www.8164.org/?p=1062#comment-8523 [...] Pay the Designer, on 8164 [...] [...] Pay the Designer, on 8164 [...]

]]> By: On Stage Lighting http://www.8164.org/pay-the-designer/comment-page-1/#comment-3155 On Stage Lighting Thu, 09 Apr 2009 07:45:11 +0000 http://www.8164.org/?p=1062#comment-3155 While it might be easy to resolve to not undervalue our own work, getting other people to see the value is harder. A prospective web client once told me that in her business, she could only charge what people were prepared to pay. Therefore, as she could only pay £xx, that was what I should charge my services to her at!!!!! I think the logic made sense to her, but she ended up on my "no thanks" list. Rob While it might be easy to resolve to not undervalue our own work, getting other people to see the value is harder.

A prospective web client once told me that in her business, she could only charge what people were prepared to pay. Therefore, as she could only pay £xx, that was what I should charge my services to her at!!!!!

I think the logic made sense to her, but she ended up on my “no thanks” list.

Rob

]]> By: brucemiller http://www.8164.org/pay-the-designer/comment-page-1/#comment-1924 brucemiller Tue, 17 Feb 2009 17:17:42 +0000 http://www.8164.org/?p=1062#comment-1924 BTW, this particular exec was not a new young guy. He also comes from a respected showbiz family and should know better. Good luck to the new creatives coming up and trying to make a living. I would not be surprised if some day, somewhere, a show will ask for me to get to the dub stage immediately and bring my iPhone to come up with a cool "sound" for their show in some iPhone app. THEN, if the show sells, maybe i'll be paid. Look.......I am one of the fortunate ones with a viable career and am lucky enough to have made a pretty good living for quite a while. I started when technology didn't offer the shortcuts we have today. Hire me......hire an orchestra and studio! That was the only way. My fear is for the young guys (and girls) coming up who are totally at the mercy of the "Biz" bruce BTW, this particular exec was not a new young guy. He also comes from a respected showbiz family and should know better. Good luck to the new creatives coming up and trying to make a living. I would not be surprised if some day, somewhere, a show will ask for me to get to the dub stage immediately and bring my iPhone to come up with a cool “sound” for their show in some iPhone app. THEN, if the show sells, maybe i’ll be paid.
Look…….I am one of the fortunate ones with a viable career and am lucky enough to have made a pretty good living for quite a while. I started when technology didn’t offer the shortcuts we have today. Hire me……hire an orchestra and studio! That was the only way. My fear is for the young guys (and girls) coming up who are totally at the mercy of the “Biz”
bruce

]]> By: Drew Daniels http://www.8164.org/pay-the-designer/comment-page-1/#comment-1922 Drew Daniels Tue, 17 Feb 2009 16:12:07 +0000 http://www.8164.org/?p=1062#comment-1922 Bruce's point is all too painfully telling of the business situation, where young hotshots replace competent producers and executives. It's very hard for our work to be valued when those who would do so are clueless and uneducated in the arts. And, we charitible and optimistic creative types constantly forget or marginalize the simple fact that half the population is below average intelligence, thus allowing these hotshots to target them and avoid altogether, the need for craft and sophistication. http://drewdaniels.com Bruce’s point is all too painfully telling of the business situation, where young hotshots replace competent producers and executives. It’s very hard for our work to be valued when those who would do so are clueless and uneducated in the arts.

And, we charitible and optimistic creative types constantly forget or marginalize the simple fact that half the population is below average intelligence, thus allowing these hotshots to target them and avoid altogether, the need for craft and sophistication.
http://drewdaniels.com

]]> By: brucemiller http://www.8164.org/pay-the-designer/comment-page-1/#comment-1904 brucemiller Mon, 16 Feb 2009 19:43:59 +0000 http://www.8164.org/?p=1062#comment-1904 As a tv composer, I run into this constantly. I'll never forget when a show wanted to hire me, but the head of a very large studio/prod company was quoted to tell the show, "any kid with a guitar will do". I did not get the show..............this statement said it all! bruce miller As a tv composer, I run into this constantly. I’ll never forget when a show wanted to hire me, but the head of a very large studio/prod company was quoted to tell the show,
“any kid with a guitar will do”.
I did not get the show…………..this statement said it all!
bruce miller

]]> By: Drew Daniels http://www.8164.org/pay-the-designer/comment-page-1/#comment-1902 Drew Daniels Mon, 16 Feb 2009 18:48:59 +0000 http://www.8164.org/?p=1062#comment-1902 Nowhere is the sickening lack of consumer common sense worse than the tens of thousands of audio recording amateurs who now dominate the entire recording industry with dreadful audio. An audio guru once remarked, in fact, put out a book with the title "If Bad Audio Were Lethal, We'd All Be Dead." Yet bad audio is the norm and good is as rare as an honest man. To put it in perspective, there are a million lawyers in the U.S., yet to get a good one, you'll pay $1000 an hour. There are two million CPAs in the U.S., yet I pay $350 for the yearly 45-minute visit. There are fewer than 1000 good recording engineers in the U.S. and probably fewer than 100 great ones, yet try to ask for $250 an hour for expertise that fewer than one person in three million could even dream of, and all you hear is the laughing before the phone slams down. Consumers are stupid and greedy, but amateur suppliers are too, fueling the continuous vicious cycle of bad work for bad reasons. Will someone please tell us how to break the cycle? I didn't think so.... http://drewdaniels.com Nowhere is the sickening lack of consumer common sense worse than the tens of thousands of audio recording amateurs who now dominate the entire recording industry with dreadful audio. An audio guru once remarked, in fact, put out a book with the title “If Bad Audio Were Lethal, We’d All Be Dead.” Yet bad audio is the norm and good is as rare as an honest man. To put it in perspective, there are a million lawyers in the U.S., yet to get a good one, you’ll pay $1000 an hour. There are two million CPAs in the U.S., yet I pay $350 for the yearly 45-minute visit. There are fewer than 1000 good recording engineers in the U.S. and probably fewer than 100 great ones, yet try to ask for $250 an hour for expertise that fewer than one person in three million could even dream of, and all you hear is the laughing before the phone slams down. Consumers are stupid and greedy, but amateur suppliers are too, fueling the continuous vicious cycle of bad work for bad reasons. Will someone please tell us how to break the cycle? I didn’t think so….
http://drewdaniels.com

]]> By: Firgs http://www.8164.org/pay-the-designer/comment-page-1/#comment-1633 Firgs Tue, 03 Feb 2009 02:45:10 +0000 http://www.8164.org/?p=1062#comment-1633 AMEN! I wrote a similar article myself. http://designbyfirgs.com/blog/2008/12/freelance-isnt-free/ AMEN!

I wrote a similar article myself.
http://designbyfirgs.com/blog/2008/12/freelance-isnt-free/

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